Any idea if Fanne is an AIK player who is joining Luton in January, or a Luton player who is back on loan at AIK? Soccerway says he is on loan, the other sources not quite clear... GiantSnowman 17:47, 22 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The Stockholm newspaper Aftonbladet wrote: "Fanne, som har gjort tolv allsvenska matcher för AIK i år, ansluter till Championship-laget Luton den 1 januari". Which means: "Fanne, who has done twelve Allsvenskan matches for AIK this year, joins the Championship team Luton on 1 January". Geschichte (talk) 20:03, 22 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

BBC say "Luton Town have signed Lamine Fanne from AIK on a deal to begin in early 2025, with the midfielder due to return to the Swedish side until the end of the year". Luton have similarly mixed phrasing: "After passing a medical, putting pen to paper and meeting his new team-mates... Fanne will make an immediate return to Sweden where he will finish the season which ends in November. Fanne... will come to Kenilworth Road permanently in January". It is slightly confusing in that both sources have worded it in ways that could be interpreted in different ways, though neither of the sources specifically mention the word loan. In both sources, I think "return" is meant in that he is literally physically returning to Sweden, rather than how it is usually used as a football transfer phrase. All my warmest wishes, ItsKesha (talk) 18:02, 23 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks Kesha, I had the same confusion! GiantSnowman 19:44, 26 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Hi, does anyone know if Defensor Sporting is shortened and displayed as Defensor in the infobox? Social media accounts of both the club and the league use their full name. It is written as Defensor Sporting in the 2024 Uruguayan Primera División season article and during previous seasons as well.

As someone who regularly edit articles in Uruguayan football, I always used Defensor Sporting. However, an IP insist it should be shortened to Defensor in the page of Damián Suárez. Would love to see your inputs in this cuz few years ago probably this same user or someone else with the same style of edit summary insisted it should be displayed as Defensor in the page of Sebastián Abreu as well. This just made me confused. So if I am wrong, I could make changes to other pages I edit related to the club. Thanks in advance! Kokoeist (talk) 00:38, 23 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Hi! The complete name of the club is Defensor Sporting, but many people in football call them as "Defensor". I am from Argentina and I know about uruguayan football. --Raúl Quintana Tarufetti (talk) 02:37, 23 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Thing is, we're writing for the intelligent general reader of English, not for the subject-matter expert. The reader tends to use the infobox for a quick lookup of the player's career without having to read the rest of the article, and we shouldn't be making them hover, click, or otherwise interact with the screen when we could just let them see which of the nine South American clubs listed at the disambiguation page (and doubtless dozens more without English Wikipedia articles) is meant.

As to current practice, of my sample of 40 Defensor Sporting players (those listed from G to J in Category:Defensor Sporting players) five don't have clubs listed in an infobox. Of the remaining 32, two show Defensor, one shows Defensor SC, and the rest show Defensor Sporting. cheers, Struway2 (talk) 09:12, 23 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I’ve personally always heard them referred to as Defensor but I agree, we’re writing for English speakers here who don’t necessarily have much info on the topic so I’d say we go with the club’s full name on this one. REDMAN 2019 (talk) 21:58, 28 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

(courtesy ping to @Greg) I just got a question on my talk here about a five-team view of a league table with a team highlighted and it's markup I'm unfamiliar with. Does anyone know how you would get this view from data at 2024–25 South African Premiership? Happy editing, Perfect4th (talk) 21:33, 23 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Soccerking.greg127 and Perfect4th: I added the onlyinclude tags to the table on the 2024–25 season page so that when transcluded only the table section is shown, and then I added show_limit of 5 to show only five teams. After these changes the wikicode of {{:2024–25 South African Premiership|showteam=KZC}} will display the following:

Pos	Team v t e	Pld	W	D	L	GF	GA	GD	Pts	Qualification or relegation
4	Chippa United	4	2	1	1	5	4	+1	7	Qualification for 2025–26 CAF Confederation Cup
5	Polokwane City	4	2	1	1	5	5	0	7
6	Kaizer Chiefs	3	2	0	1	6	4	+2	6
7	Golden Arrows	5	2	0	3	4	4	0	6
8	Stellenbosch	3	1	1	1	4	3	+1	4

Does this match what you wanted? --SuperJew (talk) 22:08, 23 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Ah, so it's the magical onlyinclude! Can't speak for Greg but it looks good to me. Thanks! Happy editing, Perfect4th (talk) 00:42, 24 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Yes. Wow thanks very much to the both of you. GREG (talk) 14:42, 24 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

By analogy with Template:UEFA Champions League winners and similar, do you think we can have navigation boxes for national champions? Two examples are below.

Like the Champions League template, those would only be added to the articles on the teams concerned. They would also serve as compact and minimalistic lists of all the champions of the country, particularly useful in cases like Gibraltar or Afghanistan where there isn't a centralized list but different pages show the winners of different leagues for the period of their existence.

An issue I'm foreseeing is that this could usher in the creation of similar templates for various less important tournaments, such as cup competitions, second-division leagues, state leagues, youth leagues, etc. --Theurgist (talk) 21:59, 24 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Many of the leagues you are wanting this for: Premier League, Moldovan National Division, whoever, already have centralized lists of winner, which are probably only a couple of linked articles away from the main articles of the teams. Perhaps this is overkill. Matilda Maniac (talk) 22:49, 24 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Is the Champions League template not overkill then? --Theurgist (talk) 20:26, 25 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Has returned (nay, he never left). Operates almost solely on top-notch Portuguese players/managers (or Portugal-based, past or present), adding several over-the-top info (in my humble opinion) that needlessly enlarges articles. Much more serious, continues to add copyrighted images to pages, for example reinstating the pics at Pedro Neto and Nuno Mendes immediately after they were removed (through this IP https://en.wikipedia.org/key/Special:Contributions/2001:8A0:683C:4F00:2431:37FB:2383:CC6D; "forbidden" pic at João Palhinha has also been reinstated). At Mendes, also this (https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Nuno_Mendes_(footballer,_born_2002)&diff=prev&oldid=1247539920), they added info i reverted because i thought it was WP:OVERDETAIL. Then i thought, "OK, maybe he's onto something and i now reinstate the bit" (youngest player to appear in final/win title for Sporting CP); but then, i go read the La Vanguardia article that they inserted and, lo and behold, the player is not mentioned ONCE in there! Just found another IP, this one used over two months (https://en.wikipedia.org/key/Special:Contributions/82.154.212.152).

And i suppose many more socks exist, back in the day i was almost sure that User:Pinzunski was one of them (exact same M.O.) but the check did not yield any proof and i (or WP because of me) was threatened with legal action; they were blocked nonetheless, because of the threats and not because of the puppetry. So, that was the end for me regarding this type of report, others are much more equipped than me in that department.

But Mr. Martim is still relentless in his actions, that much is a given! Attentively, happy work everyone. RevampedEditor (talk) 14:38, 25 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

As can be seen here example, there are lots of footballpages that have multiple subsections with the same name. Is there a way to link to a specific subsection. (I'm aware this Q. ought to be asked at the helpdesk (or somewhere else). I did and got no good answer. + It seems to be specific footbal articles problem.) Dutchy45 (talk) 00:59, 26 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Adding a number after the repeated subsection will link to the correct subsection. For example, [[2023–24 UEFA Women's Champions League qualifying rounds#Bracket 2]] links to the Tournament 2 bracket. — Jkudlick ⚓ (talk) 01:33, 26 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Indeed, it's documented at Help:Section#Section linking: An underscore and number are appended to duplicate section names. E.g. for three sections named "Example", the names (for section linking) will be "Example", "Example_2" and "Example_3". (I had to find this myself last week as someone had reintroduced duplicate section headings on an article I had amended to make them unique). Spike 'em (talk) 09:12, 26 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Worth noting that MOS:HEAD explicitly states that section headings within an article should be unique -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 09:17, 26 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

A MOS is nice to have, but how would you suggest to actually do it in an article such as the one linked above? --SuperJew (talk) 09:53, 26 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Please review the User contributions for 2804:14C:DA98:8B51:773C:DF23:436B:490A, who edited about 20 foodball club articles, usually changing uniform colors. Many of these have already been reverted. Very likely they should all be reverted, but this is not an area I know much about, so I leave this task to others. The oldest such edit for review is Revision of 12:32, 13 September 2024 (UTC) of Zira FK. If you have the expertise to say that these edits are OK, please comment here, so other editors (and I) will know the job is done. —Anomalocaris (talk) 05:37, 27 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Since that message this editor has edited more than 10 more football club articles and has not replied to a message on their talk page. —Anomalocaris (talk) 07:19, 30 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Perhaps worth posting on WP:ANI --SuperJew (talk) 07:54, 30 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

SuperJew: Step 1 is for one or more editors who know football to comment on whether the IP editor's contributions are in any way helpful or not. I believe ANI should wait until then. I intentionally did not indent my second posting here because I considered it a continuation of my first post. —Anomalocaris (talk) 08:34, 30 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

There is a requested move discussion at Talk:Mohamed Kamara#Requested move 20 September 2024 that may be of interest to members of this WikiProject. Safari Scribe 09:42, 27 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Should/can Facebook be used as a source for appearances. For example, the stats of Paulo da Silva as seen in his infobox for Club 12 de Junio in 2023, and accordingly at List of men's footballers with 1,000 or more official appearances. All my warmest wishes, ItsKesha (talk) 16:16, 28 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

For appearances, I wouldn't really say so. There are sometimes reasons for other things. For example, for a player signing announcement. Sometimes small clubs don't have a website, and they might post an announcement there. I've used it in situations like that where I couldn't find something else. RedPatch (talk) 16:22, 28 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

(ec) It's the club's official Facebook page so (IMO) it's no different to using the official club website as a source -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 16:22, 28 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Facebook may sometimes be a reliable source. "The official page of a subject may be used as a self-published, primary source, but only if it can be authenticated as belonging to the subject." - see WP:FACEBOOK. Paul W (talk) 16:23, 28 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Ummmm… the squad section? REDMAN 2019 (talk) 21:52, 28 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Deleted. Apart from anything it was out of date and having a picture of every player is more suited to a club website than WP ColchesterSid (talk) 14:21, 30 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Regarding the Pakistan national football team records and statistics, is there a clear method to determine which matches should be included in the individual records of players? For reference, please consider the following:

• Pakistan national football team results (1950–1989)
• Pakistan national football team results (1990–1999)
• Pakistan national football team results (unofficial matches)

I have added explanations in those articles for all matches where there is some doubt, including sources considering those matches as official and unofficial to justify each case. Initially, I relied on fifaranking.net, but many matches not listed there appear in RSSSF (as official) and Eloratings, creating confusion.

A notable example is Haroon Yousaf. According to RSSSF and Dawn, the biggest English-language and newspaper of record in Pakistan, he is credited with 51 appearances, making him the highest-capped Pakistani footballer. However, several of these matches, particularly from the 1992 Jordan International Tournament, are deemed unofficial by several sources. This leads me to suspect that, like many other football associations, the Pakistan Football Federation may also have ignored the ruling and counted those matches as official.

Moreover, many goalscorers before 1989 for Pakistan remain unrecorded. As of now, Muhammad Umer has 11 recorded goals, including those from disputed matches, which would make him the joint top scorer alongside Muhammad Essa, but idk if to count them or not.

Does anyone have any insight or guidelines on how to handle this issue of determining which matches to officially include in the records. Thanks JayFT047 (talk) 13:03, 29 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]